Thousands of Chickens Burn Alive; CCF Is Amused
Published June 03, 2009 @ 05:16PM PT
[Edit: When you're done reading this post, wander over to this related post about a similar fire that has since taken place.]
The Center for Consumer Freedom and its unscrupulous mouthpiece are fond of pretending that they do care about at least basic animal welfare but that they're just "normal" about it, as opposed to those of us who are extreme--that is, those of us who really care about eliminating unnecessary suffering rather than just occasionally pretending to care for sake of PR. Well, here's one of those great examples of how much they care:
What's he referring to? What's so funny that it calls for his trademark flippancy and sarcasm? Thousands of chickens were burned alive in Washington State late last night and early this morning. Clearly hilarious.
Fellow animals able to feel terror and pain every bit as much as you and I were trapped inside enormous sheds, while smoke joined the usual burning ammonia in their lungs, while they panicked, while they screamed out and flapped their wings as much as their cramped quarters and burdened bodies would allow, while they burned alive, trapped and with no hope of escape. And a propaganda artist who likes to set himself and his clients up as the level-headed ones, as the ones who represent the majority of Americans and consumers, thinks it's funny. He's just disappointed that they burned to a crisp inside a shed rather than on his grill. The panic, the horror, the terror, the pain--it's all irrelevant.
Screw you, Martosko. Screw you.
And while we're talking about this nightmare, exactly how many chickens died? Oh, we don't know yet, or at least it's not printed in the news stories I've located (this fire/rescue news site finds the story funny too apparently; "Chickens Fry in Washington Blaze," it quips). We just know it was in the "thousands." But we do know, of course, that the massive blaze caused $2.2 million in "damages." Money, as always, is what's important. Not unknown thousands of individual living beings, each one of whom had his or her own personality, each one of whom wanted to live, each one of whom suffered, in terror, as much in that fire as either you or I would have--and each one of whom undoubtedly suffered horribly up until those final terrible moments too.
Almost exactly a year ago, I wrote in a personal space about media reports on a fire in Boston in which countless lobsters died. There too, the real victims--the animals themselves--didn't matter. We didn't hear about how many lobsters died. We didn't read about how awful their deaths must have been--after all, they were just lobsters, and people were going to boil them alive anyway, right? Instead, the lamentations were over how many pounds of "lobster" were "lost," how much money went up in smoke.
I don't have the words to conclude this post poetically or wittily. I'm just too sad. I'm just too disappointed. I'm just too angry and in awe of human callousness and carelessness and lack of compassion. We are not the superior species we claim to be.
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Stephanie Ernst is an independent animal rights advocate, a vegan, a tree-hugging environmentalist, and a freelance editor and writer. She lives in St. Louis with an aging corgi-lab and an adolescent rescued pit bull. In her advocacy, she works to challenge prevailing perceptions of animals, to show the connections between animal exploitation and other injustices, to help people see that animals are more like us than different, and to encourage compassionate, nonviolent living and eating.
oh, wow. I was disgusted enough w/Martosko's cruel "humor", but to see it echoed in a freaking *news* report? You'd think journalists would know better than to openly mock suffering, even if they are "just animals." Jeez.
Posted by Kelly Garbato on 06/03/2009 @ 06:43PM PT
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This is, unfortunately, quite the predictable response to such suffering.
Posted by Alex Melonas on 06/03/2009 @ 07:25PM PT
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I'm surprised the media didn't use the typical "no one was killed" line, when reporting the story.
Posted by Sue G. on 06/03/2009 @ 07:54PM PT
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I am outraged I am so mad right now I know what I would like to do to that monster can not say!!!!!! What a bastard I hope he and the rest of them rot in the flames of hell for eternity!!!!!!!!!!! Greedy damn bastards!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Tierney Grinavic on 06/03/2009 @ 08:14PM PT
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Ditto David.
I could not agree more. We are dealing with a dark side of humanity which challenges us every minute of every day. But the more we speak out against arrogant unfeeling people, the more we challenge their sense of reality, the more we can change society.
I believe in the process of advocating for those who cannot defend themselves.
Posted by maria brullo on 06/08/2009 @ 03:47AM PT
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Martosko is a creep. I believe there's justice and Martosko will remember this and he won't be laughing then.
Posted by Janet Elizabeth Geren on 06/03/2009 @ 08:39PM PT
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What a total Moron Martosko is. This is unbeliebale that humans can put a $ sign on something this tragic.
I'm sooo sad:(
Posted by Mandi Traut on 06/03/2009 @ 09:26PM PT
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I hope Martosko meets the same fate soon,when he enters hell,screaming and burning to a crisp over and over.I hope Karma gets him soon.I like to do the same to him and his greedy partners.
Posted by David Tsosie on 06/03/2009 @ 10:57PM PT
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What an arrogant, heartless, greedy and uncompassionate thing this Martosko is. He has a heart of stone and just wants to line his greedy pockets.
He stands for everything I hate about the human race.
My heart goes out to all these beautiful chickens and the pain and suffering they must have endured. It is just incomprehensible. I hope so much that they have gone to a 'better place' and all memories of their pain and fear is gone.
SALLY D.
Posted by SALLY DIX on 06/03/2009 @ 11:29PM PT
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Washington state has become a state of money and little else. It's all about the money. Little compassion for inoocnet animal or human rights. Like the gortons Fish Corp, it is all about the money. The only way to shut down this industry is to boycott their products and business. It is the only thing they understand.
Shame on this sorry excuse of a human being. More like a monster.
Posted by Darcy Johnson on 06/03/2009 @ 11:37PM PT
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what a totally heartless report martosko is a srry excuse for a human being.i'm so sad for these poor chickens
Posted by Mary Foley on 06/04/2009 @ 12:21AM PT
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Yes and unfortunately the mainstream media isn't much help either; it is designed to serve the "status quo" way of looking at these things--from a monetary loss standpoint rather than a compassionate, human one. :(
Posted by Lisamarie Dean on 06/04/2009 @ 02:32AM PT
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this page would go up in flames if I used the words I am thinking about this monster, he better pray his own end doesn't come the same way, burnt alive, how horrible. sign up for fire 1 training, they'll give you an idea of how that heat feels just being close enough to try to rescue.
martosko is a pathetic excuse for a human, how impotent can a mind become?
Posted by Sheila Gredzinski on 06/04/2009 @ 04:10AM PT
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any ideas on how to get this guy removed, if he is still holding his position?
Posted by Sheila Gredzinski on 06/04/2009 @ 04:14AM PT
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The Center for Consumer Freedom is not going to take issue with what Martosko said. One of the CCF's main purposes is opposing animal rights and even animal welfare reforms; it's all about acting on behalf of industry and corporations. This is Martosko's standard attitude when it comes to animals, and his higher-ups don't care about animals any more than he does.
Posted by Stephanie Ernst on 06/04/2009 @ 05:56AM PT
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Oh, my God! That is just awful, and completely unacceptable. Too many people think that animals are just property, money lost or money gained, just like everything else, and that viewpoint must change.
Posted by Brooklyn Baron on 06/08/2009 @ 06:38AM PT
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I expect low class responses from Martosko, but from the news - that breaks my heart - I suggest everyone write (a nice letter) to that news outlet letting them know that their response to what happened is unacceptable!
Posted by Kristen Magno on 06/04/2009 @ 06:20AM PT
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I would just like to state that I just wrote them a letter, since my Dad is a Captain 2 for LA City - seeing a response as callous as that from fellow firefighters is heartbreaking. Hopefully I'll get a response from them, If I do I'll let you know what they say...
Posted by Kristen Magno on 06/04/2009 @ 06:32AM PT
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Thanks, Kristen.
Posted by Stephanie Ernst on 06/04/2009 @ 08:33AM PT
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Hi, friends. I do want to clarify that I don't think that the original news station from which the fire/rescue site took its article used that headline--I imagine the headline at Firehouse.com in its news section was created by someone running that site.
Posted by Stephanie Ernst on 06/04/2009 @ 06:39AM PT
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I'd like to see people who treat animals as "things" be treated that way themselves sometime.
Posted by Elisabeth Robson on 06/04/2009 @ 08:24AM PT
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Thanks for writing about his, Steph!
Posted by Tracy Habenicht on 06/04/2009 @ 08:58AM PT
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Just the picture was enough to get my heart pounding. What a horrific way to die.
Posted by Lisa Smolen on 06/04/2009 @ 09:11AM PT
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More and more innocent lives to mourn....and yet we have to keep acting.
Posted by Carol E McCormick on 06/04/2009 @ 10:43AM PT
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What a sadistic heartless creep you are, martosko! How can you be so pathetically unattuned to the suffering of other living creatures? You are an absolute monster.
Posted by Nora Jones on 06/04/2009 @ 06:21PM PT
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it again seems humans are worse & worse bad , barbaric , monsters, more worse kilings & it is every day every breath , every moment in dialogues - & killing animals is intentional perverse pleasure increasing in waves, it is appearing on tourist spots & banks , & eating the meals - they chew like mafia, veery chew is telepathic rape kill to some other victim. i mean -let's not be surprised by this boil chicken veent -it is very calculated ; & the heat with global waring - deliberate
Posted by suzanne o'meara on 06/05/2009 @ 11:06AM PT
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Wow,if they do this to animals are we next here in the usa .It is ,truly discusting what have we become a nation without compassion
Posted by marge brennan on 06/05/2009 @ 02:36PM PT
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Is there any justice? Martosko must remember this and then he won't be laughing then.
Posted by Doru Deaconu on 06/07/2009 @ 04:37AM PT
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This kind of thing has happened before - ducks and geese were killed in a fire in a foie gras production plant, and hundreds of pigs were left to drown in midwest flooding a year or so ago. It's the way agribusiness sees animals - as just inventory, not as living things. We need to shift this way of thinking to realize that animals suffer just as we do. It's not right to keep thousands of any kind of animal all together in one place where this kind of thing could happen.
Posted by Sara Pollock on 06/07/2009 @ 03:26PM PT
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This is a horrible story for sure... of course for the chickens - I can't imagine a more awful death. But then, it happens very frequently in the animal killing business... these infernos that torture imprisoned animals to their last breath. Google "hog farm fire" and you'll see what I mean. But seeing that they loose over a million pigs a year in transport alone - it's no big deal for them.
However, they always think it's a "tragic" loss in the financeial sense and it's always the money they grieve most.
And of course, it's no coincidence that these accidents happen when grain prices go up... or when the industry might be facing a downward trend. Better to let the insurance companies pay for the loss. A nice crisp fire in a hog barn or chicken house... who really can trace the origin?
Now, the open callousness of this CCF Martosko guy is a new wrinkle. Although he has spoken of fires and firebombing extensively during his testimony given Before the United States Senate, Committee on the Environment and Public Works on May 18, 2005 "Environmental and Animal-Rights Terrorism and Its Above-Ground Support System". Here he elaborates about "crimes" committed by animal rights groups... There is much discussion of fires here in this 66 page PDF:
http://epw.senate.gov/109th/MARTOSKO_TESTIMONY.pdf
Now... this guy reminds me of another creep... a CCF affiliate and a spokesman for Animal Ag Alliance - He's a minister... he states clearly in a recent podcast recorded at their annual summit: "Why should we care about animals? If you believe in evolution - We won. If dolphins don't like it maybe they should grow opposable thumbs and farm us in a million years".
Furthermore, in his religious anti-animal opinions he concludes that "God commands us to use animals"... in essence that all western religions require the sacrifice of animals to the good of man.
I highly recommend anyone interested in knowing their position more thoroughly to listen to his little spew of hatred.
http://www.agritalk.com/podcast/p.php?file=2009-05-12_may_12-09.mp3
or read here:
http://www.animalagalliance.org/current/home.cfm?Section=2009_0514_Baptist&Category=Press_Releases
There is no fighting "fire with fire" with these people... I suggest a verbal drowning of their vicious lies and barbaric practices... Stephanie, if it's okay - I'm going to reblog this so others can see the true insensitivity of these monsters.
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/07/2009 @ 03:56PM PT
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Where I live in Manitoba, Canada I hear of fires at hog/chicken farms all the time in the news. And everyone seems more worried about the monies lost then the poor animals that died a horrible death. I get really upset when I hear of these fires because the way these anmals die is passed off as meanigless. Like their lives are not important or not worthy of compassion. It's like people do not see that these innocent animals do feel pain and suffer horribly in these fires....
Posted by Kerri Zimmerman on 06/07/2009 @ 04:12PM PT
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Oh... just thought you'd be interested in the tweets regarding this story and the comments posted here... to them it seems vegans lack "a sense of humor"...
http://twitter.com/dmartosko
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/07/2009 @ 05:31PM PT
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Most people don't give a rat's behind about animals other than how they taste like or how their skins look like with their dress, shoes, or shirt. Typical of human beings-the coldest, most disgusting species of ape on this planet, for their cruelity is DELIBERATE, with full awareness. EVERY SECOND, every day, animals scream in terrible agony by the millions due to human cruelty. Nobody cares.
Posted by L. Swa_ on 06/07/2009 @ 06:13PM PT
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Well those who patronize and eat chicken meat-just by touching the raw meat, one can contract MRSA due to the antibiotic abuse-used to keep them alive as they live in excrement and filth. Their lungs burn from the ammonia fumes from excrement. In addition, it is LEGAL for chicken farmer to put ARSENIC in the chicken feed, which makes the meat a slight pinkish color: That's arsenic poisoning. Oh it's legal and USDA/FDA approved. MRSA kills more people than AIDS and costs the health care system billions to treat every year. I just think it's funny the EATERS OF FLESH become THE EATEN: It's called KARMA.
Posted by L. Swa_ on 06/07/2009 @ 06:16PM PT
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What an asshole.
Posted by Karmah Lawson Bourne on 06/07/2009 @ 07:50PM PT
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this isn't a case of animal rights activists vs. society. even my chicken-eating friends would be sad to hear this story. so it's really about the cold-hearted minority vs. the compassionate majority. let's hope that the compassionate majority starts to question the necessity and damage of their everyday habits, including what they buy and what they eat.
Posted by Catherine Turley on 06/07/2009 @ 07:57PM PT
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I have to hope you are right that there is a "compassionate majority". I often excuse people with the reasoning that they just don't know or don't think things through enough... to see the truth. But then I wonder - is it deliberate that they don't think? Because it will necessitate "change".(?) Or worse yet... that compassion is a virtue only a minority possess - and if that's the case - what of the world and our future in it?
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/07/2009 @ 09:23PM PT
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I think that people are naturally compassionate - there are a couple of problems, though:
1) kids are not encouraged to retain this natural compassion because it is viewed (especially in boys) as a sign of innocence & naiveté.
2) adults are not encouraged to display compassion because of social expectations (again, especially men).
Fear is a huge factor for people to hide their disgust or objection to certain issues. I am not the only veg here who has heard "I don't want the animals to be treated inhumanely" come from an omni. And I believe them. BUT the trick is to take the next step so that actions align with beliefs.
Being "labeled" a vegetarian or vegan can be scary for some people - and prevent them from taking the next step to remove themselves from the process.
Posted by Lisa Smolen on 06/07/2009 @ 10:44PM PT
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All I can hope, aside from praying nothing like this happens again, is karma gets him for this. Him, and everyone else who feels this way. Either that, or by some miracle they have a change of heart. People like that most likely wouldn't truly care even if it had been humans.
Posted by Nancy Alexander on 06/07/2009 @ 07:59PM PT
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This is so wrong, on so many levels.
So I am going to choose just one point.
The comments by those with apparently no feelings and poor taste were in fact beyond disgraceful. They were callous, flagrant, disrespectful, lacked tack and showed a self centred, disregard for life that outrages me.
If in fact some of the comments were made by people unable to comprehend within themselves the tragedy and buried it in such tones, they themselves need to learn to be quiet and take some classes in self improvement, facing their hidden internal fears and many courses in tact and grace (or perhaps just learn to muzzle their verbal garbage).
But HELLO everyone... I very sincerely don't think retorting with; "screw you" lends any more credibility to other side of the discussion.
The situation disgusts and outrages me, I am galled by the arrogance and greed that leads these individuals to believe they can behave in such a manner and not be judged.
BUT if we (those who believe animals should be treated with dignity and respect) demand such things as dignity and respect on behalf of animals; we should be able to deliver an effective, assiduous response with dignity, respect and grace. It's the only way to point out the "differences", clearly and decisively.
Posted by Ingrid K. on 06/07/2009 @ 08:36PM PT
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Hi, Ingrid. If you'd had any direct (draining, infuriating) dealings with Martosko or had been watching for any length of time the things he says and does, you might better understand why I wasn't too concerned with tact when addressing him directly in my post. That's not how I would have responded to (or how I ever do respond to) any random person or anyone open to and capable of changing his or her mind and attitude; I'm normally much gentler, and I am mindful that most people just don't "get it" yet. And obviously, I did write this while angry. But though I absolutely respect your right to disagree with my language--and I myself am critical of the way some animal advocates often respond (violently, condescendingly, etc.) to people in run-of-the-mill conversations or disagreements--in this one case, with this particular person, I don't feel the need to apologize for it.
Posted by Stephanie Ernst on 06/08/2009 @ 07:57AM PT
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To put a comedic spin on the situation;
Martosko could possibly be considered an inflammatory agent for which an application of the total production run of last years hemorrhoid preparations would be hard pressed to reduce.
I cannot help but conclude that in being such an agent he is doing little more than goading the rest of us to behave on the level he chooses... HIS!
Your note indicates that he is comfortable in this role.
Any endeavour that continues the argument actually inhibits any action towards change.
I will not lower myself. That in itself is judgement that cannot be washed away, nor can it be deflected, attacked or incited with yet more inflammation.
But when all is said and done, these types of persons only have limited use.
Every effort should be made to ensure that people learn and understand that through grace and tact and then with a solid application of those weapons available to we who do not agree we are able to have our standards implemented. And in this day and age the weapon is money.
Having said that; I will put forth my method of dealing with my distaste over the "chicken issue"...
I buy my eggs from a farmer who truly has free range chickens. When I can, I buy my chicken from him, otherwise I decline their consumption. I am lucky and live in a city where I can drive 20 minutes and indulge both my hatred of how commercial chickens are treated and support those I feel are deserving AND maintain my choice of being carnivorous.
This is not an easy option for let's say; someone living in L.A. But as a vegan you know how to live without eggs and chicken.
What do you suppose would happen if you were to begin educating or provisioning the links to information that would allow others to "live without chicken or eggs". And then we all enforced our opinion(s) by not purchasing commercially produced chicken and eggs.
Now that would be the ultimate revenge on this rather disagreeable individual - I can most certainly guarantee you that the second his tactics stop the flow of cash his head will go to the block.
Ultimately; what you give, returns to you. And we have amongst us the means to return it; threefold.
Persons of that nature are of limited use, because their role is to be inflammatory. His time will most certainly come and pardon the pun; we can be pleased that it finally came home to roost.
Posted by Ingrid K. on 06/08/2009 @ 09:18AM PT
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Someone should be convicted and tried and jailed for the burning alive torture of these chickens.Perhaps the farmerswho keep chickens like this,or lawmakers who make it possible.OR BOTH.
Posted by Shaynie Aero on 06/08/2009 @ 01:30AM PT
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Our farm factories routinely torture birds-chickens ARE birds, mostly forced to live its entire life in a cage no larger than a sheet of paper; chickens are intelligent animals-can you imagine the torture just from that alone. They live in their own feces; their lungs burn from the ammonia fumes of the excrement, given daily doses of antibiotics to keep them alive in pure filth, used as a growth stimulant. Often their bones become brittle from forced non-activity and break easily-so they live with broken bones. In addition they are man handled-body slammed into cages, as though they were pieces of plastic, further breaking bones. When it comes to slaughter, their heavy bodies are hung upside down, still alive, and often the blades miss their throats. They are dunked-still alive-in boiling water, boiled alive. STUNNING THEM WITH ELECTRICITY DOES NOT MAKE THEM UNCONSCIOUS-they feel the electrictity, and they feel the boiling water as they are dunked alive. Burned alive in a barn cruel? That's nothing compaired to what is NORMALLY done to them. With meatless alternatives that tastes just like chicken, this is totally unecessary. But people are people. "but chicken tastes good." To these cruel idiots, it was a tasty meal. But to the chicken it was their life-and nobody cares about that. NOBODY.
Posted by L. Swa_ on 06/08/2009 @ 03:56AM PT
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Even "free roaming" chickens is often a lie. MOST of their life they are kept in small cages. To meet this requirement in advertising, they are set free from the cage a week before slaughter. They still live in filthy confined areas, and often get trampled to death. I find it sad people are so cruel-which is a testimony of how people are. Chickens are NOT chickens-they are BIRDS-intelligent animals. Chickens are feel pain and fear like we do. WE ARE in fact, MONSTERS. Killing monsters. And that's exactly what human beings are. Cruel-ruthless, killing monsters. When you lift your hands up to pray to God, do not expect God to listen. If a person has no compassion for a simple bird or animals-they in reality have nothing inside of them. "I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he-goats. When ye spread forth your hands, I will hide Mine eyes from you: Yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: FOR YOUR HANDS are full of BLOOD, and your mouths are defiled with flesh," ~So Sayeth the Lord God, Isiah 1:15,66:3
Posted by L. Swa_ on 06/08/2009 @ 04:02AM PT
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i have become vegan and proud of it. this person and all like him should rot in hell,then we can say no casualties.
animals no matter what kind that has been tortured or harmed in mans name. GOD will call their names and they will go to the fiery pits of hell.
Posted by janey abner on 06/08/2009 @ 04:32AM PT
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Sue commented earlier in this thread about her surprise that the media didn't use the "no one was hurt" line. Since I published thie post, another large fire has occurred, this time at a turkey farm; 25,000 turkeys died in the fire, and the AP did take the opportunity to use the "no one was hurt" remark. Read more about that fire in this post: http://animalrights.change.org/blog/view/25000_are_dead_but_no_one_is_hurt_and_others_were_spared
Posted by Stephanie Ernst on 06/08/2009 @ 07:39AM PT
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As stephanie says, the CCF accuses us of being "extreme" in our compassion. Well what if we make our compassion even MORE extreme? What if we even had compassion for the CCF mouthpieces themselves? Not to say we let them get away with such remarks, but that we respond to them with the recognition that are just human beings like us who for whatever reasons in their history have lost touch with their compassion, just as perhaps we too were not in touch with our compassion at some point in our lives. Now THATs radical (and ultimately makes us th practicitioners of what we preach).
Posted by Eric M on 06/08/2009 @ 08:00AM PT
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Eric, great idea. This is truly "loving kindness" in action. I've been taught by Buddhist friends that to respond with love is the ultimate act of strength. Can you find a way to love instead of hate? A true test of character.
Posted by Lisa Smolen on 06/08/2009 @ 08:20AM PT
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Would one or some of you who think it is possible to burn in hell explain to me how a spirit or soul or whatever you call it can burn?
Posted by Kathryn Dalenberg on 06/08/2009 @ 11:15AM PT
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Hello Ingrid... I am so confused! I read in your first post: "BUT if we (those who believe animals should be treated with dignity and respect) demand such things as dignity and respect, etc..." I'm befuddled to understand what you mean "dignity and respect" to be?
Doesn't taking a life needlessly, void being able to say that you are treating them with "dignity and respect"? Can you show a living being "dignity" by stealing their life? Or be "respectful" by using their bodies as a commodity?
Perhaps you and I have a different idea as to what dignity and respect mean?
For me... I'm certain these farmed animals are not attacking us... we're not defending ourselves from them. And I'm not a bushman, or an Inuit... I drive to one of dozens of stores, and shop under florescent lights. There are usually 6 or more isles containing thousands of choices. Therefore, if I were to put the remains of a dead animal in my buggy... one could say that this animal died "needlessly"...
There was no "self defense"... No urgency for survival like living in the jungle or the arctic... No situation without choice: To purchase a "needlessly" killed innocent animal, or not.
So please explain... Do you think taking an animal's life without necessity shows "respect and dignity"?
I'm very interested because when I read your next comment in which you said that you buy (dead) chickens from some man... I got lost... somewhere between the "respect" and the "dignity"... and "chicken". (?)
And even further... you recommend the idea of encouraging people to have this respect and dignity extended to chickens by: "not purchasing commercially produced chicken and eggs." If you are paying a cent for the chicken(s) or their eggs... you are engaged in "commerce"... They are all "commercially produced" for economic gain. The flesh you buy, no matter where it came from, is a "product" from someone in the animal, (meat) "business". Does the scale really matter? Their lives are still "sold" and their "worth" hinges upon this end... Their whole existence is reduced to "value" and "bottom line". In between is a buying consumer - without whom there could be no "commercially produced", "dignified and respectfully" treated (murdered) animals.
I apologize if I missed what you were intending to say... but this is the impression I got from what you wrote. Please clarify if I'm wrong. Thanks.
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/08/2009 @ 11:40AM PT
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'm sorry I have confused you, but as I have and read your message several times I'm going to have to presume that your perspective simply is; "any production of animals for slaughter is lacking dignity and respect".
Perhaps it might be easier for you to hear my perspective this way even though I suspect you will not agree with it; I do not agree with "factory farming practices" and it is my personal opinion that "factory farming pracitices" are devoid of "dignity and respect".
In other words I believe that factory farming facilities (of any size) that do nothing but focus on the production of animals for profit in complete disregard for the animals welfare is not acceptable.
Having said that; I come from a background where I did experience farm life... the kind where animals were raised out of doors in numbers that still allowed room to roam and did not create illness due to overpopulation, with shelters, fed - well, had veterinary care, and were; under no circumstances, teased, abused or bullied in any way and were never shipped to feed lots, cross country crammed into inadequate trucks, nor were they shipped to factory type slaughter houses because we knew about their "inadequacies".
Since that time, some thirty years ago, I am sorry to say; it has only got worse.
If you have (like me) declined the grocers freezer (and therefore factory farming practises) I applaud you. If you have gone further and completely declince the consumption of meat products I respect your decision. I hope you will be able to extend me courtesy in regards to my experiences and perspectives.
I hope this response helps you out a little.
Posted by Ingrid K. on 06/09/2009 @ 08:31AM PT
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Yes this is what I "simply" meant: "any production of animals for slaughter is lacking dignity and respect".
Thanks for clarifying what you believe - that animals may be forcibly slaughtered with "dignity and respect".
I totally understand what you believe. Thank you.
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/09/2009 @ 09:20AM PT
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Martosko is just expressing what most of society feels about chickens-, our parents, our siblings, our "chicken eating friends"- everyone who eats chickens or their eggs is responsible for this tragedy. Demand is what drives this business.
Posted by Nancy Correa on 06/08/2009 @ 01:37PM PT
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I am so sorry to hear of this horrible tragedy and the terrible suffering that has occurred.
I actually cannot understand how he could make such a comment. He cannot be a compassionate person.
Posted by Amy Fitts on 06/08/2009 @ 03:08PM PT
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I want to recommend all animal advocates reading and posting here read "The Animal Activist's Handbook" by Matt Ball and Bruce Friedrich. I have been in animal rights/advocacy about 15 years and I am learning from this handbook. They specifically address how to respond to clueless people like this martosko guy. It helps us to be good advocates if we are more in control of our emotions. Book is offered at VeganOutreach.org and PETA.org.
Posted by Kathryn Dalenberg on 06/09/2009 @ 08:26AM PT
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That humans are so lacking in compassion that this type of article would be written, much less published is the result of the way we allow factory farms to treat our fellow sentient beings. Yes, anyone who eats the flesh of other sentient beings is responsible. Yes, something can be done. It is your choice.
Posted by Christine Holmes on 06/09/2009 @ 01:48PM PT
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Isn't it odd that AR people made much of the chickens perishing in the fire, but will not blink when firebombs are placed on the porches of people's homes?
Posted by R. D. Dickey on 06/09/2009 @ 07:20PM PT
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Yeah and those fire bombs are planted by psycho kooks who take delight in animal cruelty and torturing animals-of course as uneducated as you sound, you never heard of the FBI profiling that virtually all serial killers and psychopaths start off by torturing animals then graduate to killing people, also confirmed by all leading criminologist. People like you-who have NOTHING inside of you, actually frighten me.
Posted by L. Swa_ on 06/10/2009 @ 05:23AM PT
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R.D. Dickey, I get so tired of that irrelevant argument that assumes that, if you care for and speak up about animals, then you obviously have no compassion for human beings. Nothing could be further from the truth. If you have enough compassion, you can care for all inhabitants of Earth. Caring for one does not mean you do not care for the other; these things are not mutually exclusive. It is just that animal rights activists know that animals are sentient beings and humans are not as special or as superior as we think we are.
Posted by Nora Jones on 06/09/2009 @ 07:38PM PT
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We live with sick people on this planet!
Posted by Julie van Niekerk on 06/10/2009 @ 06:56AM PT
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This is crazy it was a bunch of chickens not people and no they are no comparison to us these birds where there to die I agree it was bad and I hate it as i love my animals and i have chickens I also have enough sense in my head to know that these are animals put here for food and some weren't but the chicken is to eat for meat.If we didn't kill and hunt the world would be over run with starved to death animals.
Posted by marsha nicely on 06/11/2009 @ 10:55AM PT
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Hello Marsha... what a lovely last name you have "Nicely"! That's how I was raised you know... to do things "nicely". Certainly included in this is to not cause innocent animals needless harm. The comparison I can give in regards to humans and chickens - is that they feel pain. Just like us. And in this way, we are the same - we can be hurt.
You say you have "enough sense to know these are animals put here for food"... And this "sense"... I'm curious how you arrived at such an opinion? And do you feel the same about doves? or crows? or parrots? canaries? peacocks? swans? Or does your "sense" just say: "chicken"?
I think you are sadly mistaken though... if you believe that if we didn't kill/hunt "the world would be over run with starved to death animals". If we stopped breeding animals not only would they not be starved (or killed) - but there would also be much more for humans to eat... and land to grow more food for humans to eat... and more abundant and cleaner water for humans to use...
It's really quite plain and clear - animal agriculture is taking food out of people's mouths to make "meat". And because I care so much for humans, I think this is a sad thing to let happen. You see, the resources I use for my vegan diet requires about 1/50th what a meat-eaters diet requires... And the food is lovely you know - it literally comes forth from the ground and some of it grows on trees... Surely this is what we were meant to thrive on... if we are to survive as a species.
Posted by Bea Elliott on 06/11/2009 @ 12:19PM PT
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Well said Bea.
Posted by Kathryn Dalenberg on 06/12/2009 @ 08:11AM PT
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This is sad and disgusting. What is wrong with this guy?
Posted by Elaine Hendrix on 06/12/2009 @ 02:51PM PT
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He's a Neanderthal misplaced into the 21st century. Perhaps one of the Geico insurance
guys.
Posted by Kathryn Dalenberg on 06/12/2009 @ 08:21PM PT
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Kathryn, Actually the entire story behind the Geico Insurance ads was that contrary to the stereotype Neanderthals are not coarse, dumb, brutes....
Past that there is evidence that Neanderthals lived in cohesive family groups, buried their dead so one can presume they also mourned their dead. Quite human... just like the rest of us but not so fortunate by way of environment and evolution.
Not a likely parallel for the person under discussion here...
Posted by Ingrid K. on 06/12/2009 @ 08:37PM PT
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This is the problem.
There are many shallow people out there. Their intelligence is not the highest, and it's not their fault. It's up to us to try to protect the weak from these grotesque foodies. There is something very sadistic and sick about a lot of people and their parents may have taken a lot of drugs, therefore their genes are twisted or something is wrong with their brains and the part that is supposed to be conscience. You can't change them. They are hopeless. You have to get a very strong lobby of normal people who will literally kick ass. That is all you can do.
Posted by Elizabeth Price on 10/12/2009 @ 01:51PM PT
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Only a psychopath would find amusement with the torture, agony and terror of helpless creatures. This man scares me.
Posted by L. Swa_ on 10/12/2009 @ 02:10PM PT
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